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Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 5:45 pm Post subject:

Thanks for the support everyone. I am really going to try and get some footage on this other dog and the owner. The owner has told me to my face more than once that he fights the dog. His kids have also told me that they have seen "daddy" hit her hard. The kids are just like him and they enjoy having full control over the dog. There have been so many times when I have seen their 5 year old daughter hit the poor dog and tell her she is a bad dog. Its very sad to watch.
My question is would it be illegal for me to stick a voice recorder thing in my pocket and ask him questions? He tells me straight up that he fights the dog and that she has killed a dog. Would it be violating his rights to record his voice?

Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 6:11 pm Post subject:

It is fully legal to record any and all conversations of which you are a part. It is only illegal to record other people's conversations, unless you are an officer of the law (Police, FBI, CIA, etc)... So, feel free to tape the conversations and use them as evidence. In my experience, it's very difficult to get law enforcement to move in ANY animal abuse/neglect/fighting situation, even with plenty of evidence. In some cases (animal fighting especially), it is more helpful and useful to contact the state police rather than the local, and the state District Attorney.

I really hope that you don't end up having the same experience with law enforcement that I did, but the resounding gong I hear throughout the rescue community is the same. It will take SERIOUS effort to get anything actually done about this. Good luck to you.

Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 6:12 pm Post subject:

not without police involvement. if they were to "wire" you you could do it (it requires a court order) otherwise the person has to be told he is being recorded. as far as the videogoes tho...I was thinking you could say you put it on the roof to watch the yard. you could truthfully say you dont like your neighbor, and didnt trust your dogs out in the yard if you werent there. ask the police tho. that may be a way to do it

Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 6:20 pm Post subject:

re-read the patriot act... they've techinaically madew it illegal to saveaim conversations with out both parties consent rules have changed a lot in the last year.. Rolling Eyes

Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:56 pm Post subject:

Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:28 pm Post subject:

I am not sure if this will help but around here if you call animal control more than three times and they don't do anything then you can call PETA and they will. We had a hunter around here with many hunting dogs that would starve them and let them run. I called animal control numerous times before I learned about PETA's thing and all I got was it was hunting season they are always to skinny. I called PETA and the dogs were removed within an hour of the ladies being there. He on the other hand got a $500 fine for each dog he owned. It may help to look in this maybe they will help you without having videotapes and stuff like that. On the other hand the video tape would make a strong case. Jail time baby! Or atleast it would be here. I was angry I had to go around the animal control to get something done but sad because they took so long to get out of there. Atleast none passed away before they could get help right?

Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2005 10:15 pm Post subject:

[quote="Sparkie's Mom"]

Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2005 9:14 am Post subject:

I agree with court, someone has to have the balls, no matter what the reporcussions may be, and take on whomever is not being handled by the police.

I'd call just call your local PD and simply ask them. "is it illegal to record a conversation I'm having with someone without them knowing". "would it stand up in court".

Then you'd know.

I think that's a wonderful Idea especially if he's very upfront with his fighting.

Tell him you're doing a project on fighting and you want to interview him...hahaha! maybe he's not that dumb.

Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2005 11:15 pm Post subject:

Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2005 8:16 am Post subject:

Please give updates and let us know what you're doing and stuff.
I'm very interested in knowing what happens.
I hope for the best.

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 8:55 pm Post subject: UPDATE

Just as you asked I'm giving you guys an update.
I went in and talked to an animal control officer about the whole situation. She said they are working on an abuse case involving 3 horses and that the person who called in, video taped the people in action and the bad guys didn't know. They showed the tape in court. She says she thinks it would be ok if I were to just record him telling me.

She knows that I am into rescue, spaying/neutering and all of that good stuff so she knows that I know what I am talking about. She knows I wouldn’t make this stuff up. They have been called out to their house several times and had to have police back up because they wouldn’t cooperate.

I told her that the female is pregnant and I told her about the male dog. She said she is going to go and check things out with the female. She has seen the male before so she is going to go up to them and say that she was brought a dog (she is going to describe it in detail) and ask if it’s theirs. If they say yes, she is going to talk about the collar and ask why it was so small and all of that. (Something along those lines…when she said it, it was less confusing Laughing

)

She is going to build up a case on him and she asked me to call every time something happens so that they have support as to how many complaints they would have.

She is trying really hard to get the female out before the babies come. I am so excited! I will update again soon!

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 11:14 pm Post subject:

Keep up the good work allforanimals! We need more people out there willing to do what needs to be done.

Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:28 am Post subject:

good work, allfortheanimals! but PLEASE always remember, these people are SICK and probably DANGEROUS!! keep your efforts a secret. if they find out you are interfering with "their business" it could put you, your family, and your animals in danger.
my vote would be for secretive videotaping. if you record a conversation and it is used in court, your role in this could become public. certainly, he would probably remember having the conversation with YOU.
keep safe! and good luck.

Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2005 3:21 pm Post subject:

thanks for being so wonderful about getting involved in this
horrible situation.

i have to agree with snowysmom on the recording stuff.

if you can just video tape them and from an angle that they won't be
able to figure out that it was you video taping all the better.

we have neighbors by us that if they thought we were getting in
their business, they would come out with their guns, which they
have already done in the past because of other situations going
on over there, and they have come out shooting.

its just unbelieveable what these sick people are capable of.

keep up the good work and please do your best not to have this
traced by to you or your family.

keep safe !! and thank you for trying to save these furbabies !!

Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2005 6:23 pm Post subject:

I have a jerk that lives behind me doing almost the same thing to his pitbull. Here is the sad part- this is his third dog because animal control gets called, they take the dog, and this jerk has a new dog the next day. I live in Vegas and at the city animal shelter, about 80% of the animals up for adoption are pits because of jerks like this. I know it's not legal to "liberate" someone else's dog, but obviously you felt there was no other option- I have considered doing the same many times.

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